D-Day

[LtSounders]

I though this would be a good topic to share opinions of of how you feel about D-Day?

Could it have been executed better?
What where main contributing factors?
Was the use of paratroopers highly effective?
Could the allies could of gained more speed and surprise, if so how?

[papa_kulikov]

when the american paratroopers landed they where very spread out and disorganized..........because of the mistakes of pilotes not dropping in there drop zones........i think this part of D-day was quite poorly exacuted........

[rice man]

i think it was a faliure

[imported_KeV]

A failure? In what way?

And it wasn't the pilots fault that the troops were scattered all over he||'s creation. When getting shot at, your natural reaction is to live. To live, you perform evasive maneuvers. Yes, they were ordered not to evade fire, but do you really think they thought about that when flak was bursting all around them?

Even tho D-Day cost thousands of lives, it spared tens of thousands of lives...maybe even hundreds of thousands. Who knows how long the war would have waged if D-Day had not been as successful as it was.

I'd also say that weather was a big factor in the D-Day drop behind the Atlantic Wall -- high winds undoubtably played he|| with their canopies and direction.

[papa_kulikov]

im not saying it was all the pilots faults but after the drop most paratroops where not where they were suppose to be.........so it was a disorganized fight on the ground

[-{Delta}- $m0K3]

better that havinng a chance then the flak hitting a plane and having everyone in there

[Biohazard]

Well the Germans were not suprised we landed on beaches because they were exspecting it, they could have put a bit more defenses up though. I dont blame the pilot for the being disorganized because im sure u guys would mess up if u were flying over France with flak being fired at you, but it would have been better if they would have landed at there right places. But all that matters is that we took the beaches =)

[Kobayashi]

The way the allies fooled the Germans into thinking they were landing at Calais instead of Normandy was a stroke of genius. Building a fake wooden army in England and of course the famous 'corpse that fooled Hitler' - a dead body purposely washed up on the Spanish coast by the Allies in a Royal Navy uniform, containing plans to invade Calais.

[imported_KeV]

a dead body purposely washed up on the Spanish coast by the Allies in a Royal Navy uniform, containing plans to invade Calais.

Wow, I'm embarrassed...never heard of that!

I knew of the fake armada, however. I can't remember how many fake ships were built, but it must've been enough.

[imported_invincible]

Originally posted by Biohazard@Feb 13 2004, 04:15 AM
Well the Germans were not suprised we landed on beaches because they were exspecting it
the germans were not expecting the allies to land on the beaches of normandy. i read a great book by stephen e. ambrose called Americans at War and heres what it had to say about about Operation Overlord [D-Day]. "Not one German submarine, not one small boat, not one airplane, not one radar set, not one German anywhere detected this movement [Overlord]. As General Walter Warlimont ,deputy head of operations of the German Supreme HEadqurters, later confessed, on the eve of Operation Overlord the Wehrmacht [German] leaders "had not the slightest idea that the decisive event of the war was upon them"

[imported_Shaggy]

Originally posted by Hypocrisy@Feb 7 2004, 07:10 AM
A failure? In what way?

And it wasn't the pilots fault that the troops were scattered all over he||'s creation. When getting shot at, your natural reaction is to live. To live, you perform evasive maneuvers. Yes, they were ordered not to evade fire, but do you really think they thought about that when flak was bursting all around them?

Even tho D-Day cost thousands of lives, it spared tens of thousands of lives...maybe even hundreds of thousands. Who knows how long the war would have waged if D-Day had not been as successful as it was.

I'd also say that weather was a big factor in the D-Day drop behind the Atlantic Wall -- high winds undoubtably played he|| with their canopies and direction.
It wa a failure in the way that it cost the lives of thousands of Allied Men there lives to take the five beachs. That's how it was a failure in my mind. I most deffinatley think we could have pulled that off better. here's what I think.

A. Have the Pilots dropping the bombs actually hit there target, that could of helped.
B. Spread the men out and not rush them all in to fast.
C. Have rafts out in the water spread everywhere with Snipers in them giving the infantry cover.


I could keep gonig on and on with my ideas on stuff. That's just three.

[LtSounders]

WW2 bombers where not very accurate it wasnt the pilots faults.
At the time sniper rifles where not as common on the battlefiled compared to the standard issue rifle, it would of been more expensive and costly to gain such a high amount of snipers. Also to spread the men out may have been foolish because objectives mus tbe taken by force. This startegy worked on D-Day with minor casualties except on Omaha beach which had the highest casualties, I beleive the attack on Omaha could of been a bigger succes with less casualties if allied intelligence would of been better.

[imported_KeV]

B. Spread the men out and not rush them all in to fast.

Right. So that they dwindle their chances of taking the beaches from 50/50 down to 0/100. Do you realize how much of a clusterfluck it would have been if units were sent in slowly? Atleast by rushing the troops in the Germans couldn't obliterate entire companies at their leisure.

C. Have rafts out in the water spread everywhere with Snipers in them giving the infantry cover.

WTF? What kinda dream world are you living in? When the soldiers landed on D-Day, they were facing 6-8 foot swells...how in God's name is someone going to snipe from an overturned raft?

[imported_Shaggy]

No dream world moron.

If you spread the men out it makes them harder targets rather them sending them all in together where it's just shooting into a pile and your bound to get one.

And as for rafts in the water with sniper, throw a anchor over the side and let them pick the guys out of the bunker, thats what thy're trained to do. ;)

[LtSounders]

Sorry, I'm gonna have to agree with KeV on this one. Put it this way high ranking officers with years of military experience such as Ike and Montgommery planned D-Day, I think they new what they where doing. :yup:

[imported_Shaggy]

Yeh, I think my ideas suck to, but hey, they're just ideas ;)

I think it would be neat to see what would have happened if my plan was exectued.



Wouldn't that be cool if there was a simulator where you were in charge of all those men and all and you could see how different tactics, and how they would turn out when you used them?


That would be sweet :thumbsup:

[imported_KeV]

Originally posted by Shaggy@Feb 25 2004, 09:00 PM
Yeh, I think my ideas suck to, but hey, they're just ideas ;)

I think it would be neat to see what would have happened if my plan was exectued.



Wouldn't that be cool if there was a simulator where you were in charge of all those men and all and you could see how different tactics, and how they would turn out when you used them?


That would be sweet :thumbsup:
Yeah, they're called RTS's.

[imported_KeV]

And while I'm still in my bad mood, let me pick this post apart...

If you spread the men out it makes them harder targets rather them sending them all in together where it's just shooting into a pile and your bound to get one.

I want you to grab a baseball bat. Now, go start ruffle some feathers with your local troublemakers -- by yourself. They've got baseball bats too. Sucks to be you, doesn't it?

And as for rafts in the water with sniper, throw a anchor over the side and let them pick the guys out of the bunker, thats what thy're trained to do.

And you're calling me the moron? That's surprising. Apparently, you didn't read anything in my post. How are you supposed to hit a target while your rising 8 feet, then dropping 8 feet, repeatedly?

I hate when people try to incorporate the movies into real life.

[imported_Shaggy]

No

All im saying is it would be neat to see how much worse or better tings would have turned out if we tryed those things.


Hint: the game I said would be cool.

I'de like to know how it would've turned out if we implied other tactics.

[imported_KeV]

Originally posted by Shaggy@Feb 26 2004, 12:46 PM
All im saying is it would be neat to see how much worse or better tings would have turned out if we tryed those things.
Yeah, I guess you're right. Stealing hundreds of thousands of mothers' sons on some distant battlefield does sound enticing.

To claim it would be "neat" to see if things turned out "worse or better". That's sick, bro.

[imported_Shaggy]

Not really, Im saying it would be beat to figure out a way that would have worked better.

And it's a game, video game characters don't have mothers.


Don't try to go into and deep conflict because I guaentee I know 50 times more then you WWII.


Is it that wrong to say I think It would be cool to have a game where you command squads into battle?


My bad I didn't realize that was so horrible ^_^

[LtSounders]

I wonder how some of the veterans would feel about playing vedeo games of ww2? Is it glamorising war?

(sry for drifting off topic)

[imported_KeV]

Originally posted by LtSounders@Feb 26 2004, 03:21 PM
I wonder how some of the veterans would feel about playing vedeo games of ww2? Is it glamorising war?

(sry for drifting off topic)
I've played with a guy who claimed to have served in WWII on here before -- but, I can't verify whether or not it was legit -- seemed like it, tho.

Don't try to go into and deep conflict because I guaentee I know 50 times more then you WWII.

Bring it.

[imported_Shaggy]

heh, ok, make a thread about it somewhere, Im done in this thread, no one see's my point that it would be a cool simulator.

Also, with this dispute, no one will win, because we'll both just keep arguing with eachother about whats right and whats not.

But if you insist, then go for it. Thts just my previous lesson from arguing on the internet, no one ever wins.

[imported_Matbacon]

Lol Kev was that guy a 70 year old pedofile

[imported_KeV]

Originally posted by Matbacon@Feb 26 2004, 05:37 PM
Lol Kev was that guy a 70 year old pedofile
No way dude, he seemed really cool. He was 74 or something like that, and only played an hour or two a week. I can't even remember how we found out his age -- musta been like one of those nights where everyone is like "I bet I'm older than you" in a server.

He told us that he served in the Pacific for a year and some other cool things about the era.

[imported_Shaggy]

That would be awesome.

I always wondered about how vets felt about all these WWII games. And some maps made where they could have served and seen their friends fall.


I dunno, If I were a vet I wouldn't like it to much.

[imported_Matbacon]

Some maps on COD are not real
for example

Harbour-not real

Pavlov-real

Dawnville (St Mere englise)-real

Carentan-not real

Train station-not real

Depot-not real

POW-could be real or not real depeands if they based it on a real POW camp

Ship-Could be real or not real

Chateu-not real

I think thast all of the maps rememebr i think

[Kobayashi]

What do you mean by "real" and "not real"?
:huh:
Carentan's a real place, btw.

[imported_KeV]

Actually, all the maps could be defined as "real". There were plenty of fights in railyards, depots, ports, etc.

And Carentan is a real town.

[LtSounders]

Indeed once again Kev is indfinetly right

[illeagle]

Carentan is real, and ship was also real. The Battleship Tirpitz or something

[imported_KeV]

If we really want to get nitty gritty, we can start looking at how the towns are rendered. I've studied some photographs of Carentan, and the in-game version could use a little work. I think if the developers would have incorporated more fields around the town we would have a better grasp of how the battle appeared.

[LtSounders]

Episode 3 of the mini series Band of Brother by HBO named "Carentan" is an accurate depiction of the town to the best of my knowledge, you should check it out...the whole series was done very well!