Mr George Bush...?

[Alpha_Pasta]

Good day all :)

I've been thinking. I was watching yet another anti terrorist speech today by George Bush. What has he done for the American people? In terms of health care and education etc.

We've all heard his anti terror stance but I was looking for something a little closer to home.

[Oshiri]

ohh i watched that speech.. something interesting in politics which grabs my attention.. anyways..

didn't he do some education stuff? the no child left behind policy.. we all saw the famous clip where he is informed of the 9/11 incident while reading to children ( i fi remember correctly)

[relax 1.0]

no comment. dont want to fall out with people over this.

[Dascoo]

George Bush makes us laugh. Except it's not funny when he gets people killed.

[Zach]

The no child left behind has created more problems than it solved...

[Oshiri]

im hardly surprised.

[Mig]

George Bush... zzzz... what a noob.

[DFC COL TAZZ]

as far as i can see notthing.:icon_sad:

[MidnightRider]

Good day all :)

I've been thinking. I was watching yet another anti terrorist speech today by George Bush. What has he done for the American people? In terms of health care and education etc.

We've all heard his anti terror stance but I was looking for something a little closer to home.
Something i have seen the USA do (and im a Proud American) is try to be the World Police. Bull****, we cant even keep our kids in school and off the streets. Hell we are so buried in sucking up the worlds oil we arent makeing any real effort to find cleaner engeries. BTW Mr Bush and daddy Bush both own oil feilds in Texas. Hummmm....

I have always been proud to be from my country, i beleive with all my heart in the doctrins of the USA and what it was founded on. However, running a country has become a business. In the end its about money. Its shameful to me some of the things my country has done. Should we fight a war on terror? You can be your ass. Does that mean we have to get involed with another countries affairs? No way in hell.

IMO, you watch your own back yard. When someone comes and makes trouble in your back yard. You bust their ass as hard as you can. Otherwise you keep your backyard clean and neat and take care of it. Let the guy down the road take care of his back yard his way.

[Alpha_Pasta]

Well, i'm going to NY in October - maybe I can see for myself what some of America is like. I've heard a lot about gun crime and gang violence.

[MidnightRider]

For every one storie told about gun crimes and gang violence, there are 300 stories not told about how someone helped out a fellow man.

[Oshiri]

that's how the media works.

[MidnightRider]

sad but true

[Col.Darby]

Does anyone know why Bush is always saying he is fighting "The War on Terror" to protect American Liberties and Freedoms but if you dare use those "Freedoms" by speaking out against him you are a "Nazi" or you Love the Terrorists? Oh by the way, it's the same speech he's been saying for five years now. Did you all know that Halliburton,(Dick Cheney's Cash Cow) sold Nuculear technology to Iran to enrich uranium?

[Alpha_Pasta]

Did you also know the USA and Britain armed the taliban to fight the USSR invasion of the 80s?

[MidnightRider]

Yes they did, and President Clinton even tried to take them out after that, but didnt do so in fear of a "Wag the Dog" style press cricus after his affair with Monica Lewinsky

[Oshiri]

wow... i learn some crazy stuff at CoDB :)

[MidnightRider]

Its amazing what one can learn when talking to a group of "unedjumacated kids that play games all day"

[SSD]

Hello, and Yes Bush is stupid. He has no brain what so ever.

[Oshiri]

Haha MR :)

well.. maybe not.. personally i would say he is hell bent on oil..

[MidnightRider]

No hes not stupid, hes one of the most powerful men in the USA, hes got plenty of money from oil, and hes been president for 2 terms. Does that make him a good leader? NO. But that dont make him stupid in my book either.

[SSD]

Sure maybe hes not stupid but hes not smart either. why is he still in Iraq he has no bussiness in that country anymore.

[Dascoo]

Well if he's not smart, why the hell is he your president? I'd want a president who acvtually has a high IQ, and good education. Most of the stuff he's done, he hasn't done....it's his team.

[MFKR]

Did you also know the USA and Britain armed the taliban to fight the USSR invasion of the 80s?

Yes ive heard that before, but you need to read a little bit deeper then that. There was no Taliban back then, the only real armed power in the Afgan region (besides the commies of course) was a group of resistance fighters named the Mujahideen. They had only but one mission, to depose the Marxist Afghanistany government, and the Soviet forces that occupied the country. Once the commies were out, the former Mujahideen forces splintered into many many different groups, one of the most religous of them was the Taliban. And im glad we gave weapons to the Afganis to defend themselves from a foreign invader, Russia was also a common enemy at the time. Things change, people change, alot of our former enemys are our allies now, and visa versa.

[BritishBulldog1]

Damn good post MFKR. Now I've pretty much kept out of this thread, as the question was directed at American citizens, but I will throw my 4 penneth in.

George Bush is a much ridiculed leader, which to me, seems to be rather unfair. I read somewhere that there is a strong chance that he is dyslexic or partially dyslexic and that would certainly explain some of his goofs when reading from auto cues. If he is, it's a shame he doesn't come out and say so, as I believe that would only serve to enhance his reputation.

I don't know what he has done for America, as such, but I do know that he was and is man enough to stand up for what is right.

The Taliban made no secret of the fact that Osama was hiding in Afghanistan so it was right to go in there. If any country knowingly harbours such a criminal, that is the right course of action, otherwise they remain free and unfettered to continue with other outrages.

Iraq is a different matter. It had nothing to do with Osama the rubbish bin, it had everything to do with providing access to the weapons inspectors as dictated by the UN. Someone had to draw a line in the sand after 10 years of evasion tactics. George Bush was the man with the balls to take the stance. Don't forget that Iraq had already attacked Iran, Kuwait and then Israel.

Bullies have to be stood up to and George does just that. Where would we be if Britain didn't stand up to Hitler?

BB1

[PZIV]

MFKR, you're right, but there is one little flaw. The Mujahideen was called the "northern alliance" for a reason. They in reality were seperate from the Taliban at the time. The Mujahideen just used geographical knowledge and good planning to utterly destroy the Soviets.

Once the Soviets were out the Taliban rose up as a political force. They rivaled the Mujahideen and then as you can imagine there was internal strife. They fought, and the Taliban eventually surpressed the Mujahideen, when they killed the leader Ahmed Shah Massoud with a camera bomb.

Osama Bin Laden was then kicked out of Sudan (second country after Saudi Arabia to kick him out) and came with his followers Al Qaeda to Afghanistan. The Taliban basically had the choice: Kick Osama and his trouble making buddies out, or keep Al Qaeda, which was considerable number of troops, that were well trained as well as a supply of money coming from them (in particular Osama). They, as you can imagine, chose to keep Al Qaeda as a force to keep the Mujahideen in line and out of there affairs. Al Qaeda though started to be the runs running the show and in reality it would seem was almost holding the Taliban captive. Our mistake was arming them, because we had pride issues. The Soviets screwed us over in Vietnam and we just had to f**k with them back, so there you have it.

And as far as Bush is concerned....well just don't get me started...

[SSD]

Well if he's not smart, why the hell is he your president? I'd want a president who acvtually has a high IQ, and good education. Most of the stuff he's done, he hasn't done....it's his team.

Well, hes not my president. I am Canadian.

[Dascoo]

Me too! Cept harper isn't....I basically don't pay attention to canada anymore.

[Col.Darby]

First of all...Bush is stupid! If you graduate from a University with a low C average bordering on a D average you are Dumb. He went to Yale because his father did, not because of grades. Now to avoid any kind of politicl bashing saying I'm a liberal blah blah blah let me point out this. Here is a President who sends kids to die in wars he never fought, by an administration who never fought, with an attorney general who never fought, trying to slander a senator who had his testes strapped to a car battery in Hanoi.

Now think, NO evidence has linked Iraq to 911. Sadam Hussein hated Al Quidea more than America did. Why go? Make Daddy happy. In America where they say support the troops, support the war. What have we done? Buy stickers and placed them on our cars? How many of you have sent a package to anyone in the MiddleEast? Recycled anything for the War effort?

My Father spent 2 years in Vietnam fighting for a war that turned out to be a lie. Are we to belive that this could not happen again? If you think not, I pray for you and anyone you know who has to go and fight for a C- student who bought an election.

[Master_of_Puppets]

I have not posted in years....if ever at all but when i saw this topic i couldnt help but take a peek and see how uninformed and completely mislead by the left run media of America many of you are.

First off my hat off to MFKR for that info on the Afghan/Soviet conflict

-Secondly how ignorant can you be to think that military experience and straight A's in college is the formula for presidential success??......two presidents that are regarded as our nation's greatest wartime leaders were FDR who had no experience in uniform before his presidency and Abraham Lincoln who served with the Illinois state militia for a whole three weeks in 1830' somethin.....and look at our famous General Grant....military man for life, and he is regarded as one of our worst presidents....and look at your hero John Kerry....he basically got the EXACT same grades as Bush...seeing that it was going to be either one of the two in office, we would be fighting for a C- "student" regardless: Bush-who went into Iraq and Afghan. (for the right reasons mind you :) ) and Kerry-who would be forced into a conflict with either Iraq;(who were still pusuing WMD's and the means to produce some pretty nasty stuff and would have probably succeded) or Afghanistan-who as you can see declared war on us when they became pilots......

-its a quarter past 2:00 and im tired but am not done....we can continue this tomorrow or something

[BritishBulldog1]

Good post Master of Puppets. Kerry has been proven to be a liar and a twister of the truth. Exposed on many fronts, you cannot take anything he says seriously.

You should also think Col.Darby, Entering Iraq had absolutely nothing to do with Al Quieda and everything to do with stopping Saddam from pursuing his desire for WMD. You sir, are a sorry excuse for a limp wristed liberal thinker who can't even admit to his political affiliation. No offence to your father intended, but just because he fought in Vietnam, doesn't make you any more knowledgeable.

Before you leap to Saddams defence saying no WMD were found, first ask the Iranians and Kurds if he had them. Everyone believed he still had them, because of the manner in which he kept putting obstacles in the way of the weapons inspectors. Had he given unfettered access as the UN resolution dictated, there would never have been the need to attack Iraq. So Saddam has no one to blame but himself.

BB1

[MidnightRider]

I have not posted in years....if ever at all but when i saw this topic i couldnt help but take a peek and see how uninformed and completely mislead by the left run media of America many of you are.

First off my hat off to MFKR for that info on the Afghan/Soviet conflict

-Secondly how ignorant can you be to think that military experience and straight A's in college is the formula for presidential success??......two presidents that are regarded as our nation's greatest wartime leaders were FDR who had no experience in uniform before his presidency and Abraham Lincoln who served with the Illinois state militia for a whole three weeks in 1830' somethin.....and look at our famous General Grant....military man for life, and he is regarded as one of our worst presidents....and look at your hero John Kerry....he basically got the EXACT same grades as Bush...seeing that it was going to be either one of the two in office, we would be fighting for a C- "student" regardless: Bush-who went into Iraq and Afghan. (for the right reasons mind you :) ) and Kerry-who would be forced into a conflict with either Iraq;(who were still pusuing WMD's and the means to produce some pretty nasty stuff and would have probably succeded) or Afghanistan-who as you can see declared war on us when they became pilots......

-its a quarter past 2:00 and im tired but am not done....we can continue this tomorrow or something
BB is right Kerry was exposed as a lier, and as far as im conserned, he would have made it even eaiser for 9/11 to happen, and poss sooner. Hes idea was to debunk the American defence in search of his own gain. Hero? I think not. There are many men that served in combat like Kerry and are no heros.

It has always been a great misconception that great men of the army are also good presidents. This is so far from the truth its disgraceful. But there is a logical reason for it. The president is elected from the ppl. If the ppl see that this man has done a wonderful job "fighting off the turks" so to speak, then he must be a good leader. Sadly there are ppl in the world that are willing to take advantage of that and use these fine men of the army for their own gain. These presidents are used as a figurehead. A puppet more or less.

It boils down to you can never trust some one in politics. Everyone knows this, so you are left with the decision of the lesser of two evils. Is Bush the greatest president of all time? No. He has been criticised for his inactiveness on 9/11. Hell we were all inactive on 9/11, the entire nation was stuned and rocked back on its heals. You expect the president to be any diff. Hes a red blooded american just like the rest of us.

Its unfair to judge him on his misteps in speach, i dont care if he can say onomotpeia, as long as he can do the job to the best of his ability. Bush has his money rooted in oil, but you have to get money form somewhere to run a presidental campain. Otherwise we would all be running for president if it were that easy.

I dont agree with some of the things that Bush has done, but i didnt agree with some of the things Clinton or Regan did. But on the whole they did their jobs. Regan incresed a tenitave peace with the Soviets, and Clinton brought the econemy out of a regression. Yes he screwed up with Monica Lewinsky, but i dont care if the president got his dick sucked, i want to know if he can be a good president. Same with Bush. He did what was expected of him after 9/11. He has tried to bring to justice the evil hearted men that would create such a horror. He has tried to step up the protection of this country and has been blasted for it.

If you think you can do better, then gather up your spare change out of your couch and save it up. Put that money in the bank and put it towared your presidental campain.

[Oshiri]

Bush managed to keep America pretty calm after 9/11.. the social repurcussions coulda been many times worse; but they weren't. So he deserves respect.

Also.. it seems to me that "Bush-Bashing" is more of an actual trend these days then anything else.. I'd make a rubbish president.

[Dascoo]

I remeber seeing something that bush said....I think he said that atheists shouldn't be citizens.....seriously though, religion is what you believe, so if you believe in reality, your not an atheist, you just see things realistically.

[the_morning_of]

Well im from the uk and we have the labour party in power and obv i priminister is Tony Blair, now as far as I am concerned I would never vote for the concervative party (the equal to bush) ,because well people don't understand how much we would lose, pll think that goverments just deal with wars and keeping so called immigrants out but...

say if you wer a student attending a college or a uni there would be no funding for you to go to college...or if you were a single parent you would get very little or no child support...now all this support is the backbone of are society but the people who tend to vote for the concervative party are the people with the least.
:icon_neutral:
anyway after saying all of that labour have been absolutley shocking for us they've promised us this ,that and the other and not delivered so the balls in the plls court because im seriously thinkin of not voting, I kno i really should but alot of goverments are liars so...

getting on to bust ,Fact:I DONT LIKE THE GUY , i know thats a little brash but I just never have his father was a bad president and so was he,I belive the only reason he stays in is because the country is scared,it was scared of black people 30 years ago and now it is scared of nearly everything,war,terrorism,muslims,itself(why so many guns) and change.

I still think american people as a whole are some of the greatest people on the planet but they are run by a man whos policy is fear that is the only reason he stays in power because people are scared and they no bush is a very fourthrite president . anyway probably talkin crap so seeya xxx

[MidnightRider]

It really dont matter why he is president now, as his two terms are almost up and he dont get another term. I agree with you morning, i dont like G W Bush or his father either one, but that dont mean he cant be a good president. Just because i dont like him doesnt mean that he cant do his job well.

I really dont want this to sound bad when i say this so dont take it the wrong way. Please. Most Americans are very far from scared of government. Do we know that they can crush a small resistance with a quickness? Yes. Does that stop us from voiceing our thoughts on the way things are ran? Hell no. There are things about this country that i dont like, and would liked to see changed, but that is the beauty of our government. It is up to us to change it. Its also up to us to make the diff and show others that are like minded to have the balls to vote. I have yet to see someone that i wanted to vote for. But if i dont vote, then i have no say in how things are run. If i do vote at least i can say i tried to make the diff. Its important to vote not just for president, or prime minister, or big kahona poop poo, its also important to vote for your city, state/prov mayors, reps and senat memebers.

Somewhere i once read ...

"We hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed, by their Creator, with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

That to secure these Rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the Consent of the Governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these Ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its Foundation on such Principles, and organizing its Powers in such Form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

Prudence indeed, will dictate, that Governments long established, should not be changed for light and transient Causes; and accordingly all Experience hath shewn, that Mankind are more disposed to suffer, while Evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the Forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long Train of Abuses and Usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object, evinces a Design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their Right, it is their Duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future Security."

Do you know that my kids are not taught the preamble to the United States Declaration of Independence in school. To this day i can still say it by heart. They are not taught the Pledge of Allegiance, i had to teach it to them. They didnt even know the words to Star Spangled Banner, the National Anthem. All these things i was taught as a kid, and now my kids arent being taught it in school. This in itself is a disgrace.

If i planed to come to your country to become a citizen, I would learn these things, as it would be only right to do so. It would be very disrespectful if I didnt. If you come to my country, or are born here a citizen, then in my eyes, you MUST do so.

Its a sad thing when our kids today arent even given the chance to learn about the very document that founded this country. Even so, my kids can now repeat all three of the things i mentoned above by heart, as they should. Do you know how this got removed from schools? A bill was passed that saying the Pledge of Allegiance in school might be offending to other nationlites. **** THAT. In this country you do as is done, just as i would if i went to your country. Its called respect.

[BritishBulldog1]

Its a sad thing when our kids today arent even given the chance to learn about the very document that founded this country. Even so, my kids can now repeat all three of the things i mentoned above by heart, as they should. Do you know how this got removed from schools? A bill was passed that saying the Pledge of Allegiance in school might be offending to other nationlites. **** THAT. In this country you do as is done, just as i would if i went to your country. Its called respect.

Over here, they have finally realised that foreigners that wish to live here should learn something about our culture and to at least learn to speak English.

As for the_morning_of, you have so got that back to front. Conservatives are claimed to be the choice of the better off and labour are supposed to be for the workers. Labour was born out of the trade union movement and are the politics of the jealous. They increase taxation, either directly or by stealth, to such an extent that families find it increasingly difficult to survive. The Tories left them with the best and strongest economy that this country had seen in years. Slowly but surely, this government is undoing it all. All the pain we went through when the Tories had to correct the follies of the previous Labour Government, is destined to be repeated when this government get kicked out.

BB1

[MidnightRider]

Over here, they have finally realised that foreigners that wish to live here should learn something about our culture and to at least learn to speak English.
Wish we would figure that out, its pissed a few Americans off.

[Master_of_Puppets]

to touch on a few things---

---- I have no doubt what-so-ever in my mind that there were and probably still are WMD's in Iraq (heck we even found 500 of them in a warehouse, but according to the Liberals "Uh...those wernt the ones we were looking for") i dont care if they were or not....the point is that they were there, we know Saddam lied and we found hundreds of boxes of documents (which included handwritten notes, typed documents, audiotapes, videotapes, compact discs, floppy discs, and computer hard drives.....if thats not convincing, i dont know what is) that detailed the progress and plans for proceding with the research and development of said weapons, the obvious support of Al Qaeda, Abu Nadal along with the training of thousands of terrorists within the Iraqi borders and terror camps

....for instance one of those docs was a handwritten account of a 19, Feb. 95' meeting between an Iraqi representative and Bin Ladin himself disscussing possible cooperation between the two for operations targeting foriegn forces in Saudi Arabia...Saddam was informed of the meeting on 4, March and in support of the idea blasted sermons of a radical imam requested by Bin Ladin....later that year in Nov. Al Qaeda attacked the Saudi National Guard killing quite a few (thats just one among several instances in which evidence pointed to collaberation between Saddam and other Terror Org's...... Now it may be factual that Saddam was not in kahoots with Bin Ladin when 9/11 happend, but it is impossible to disprove the fact that he was an enemy that would collaberate with whoever he could in order to do our country harm.

SORRY ITS SO LONG....I JUST HAVE ALOT TO SAY ON THE SUBJECT

Like i said THERE WERE WMD's in IRAQ....proabably still are....the rest of them were more and likely moved to Syria in and around the Bekka Valley by outside influences, such as the Russians (who proabably also gave heads up info to Saddam about our war plans and strategies....Also found in a captured document (CMPC-2003-001950
Title: Russian report on American troop dispositions in the Gulf----just to be a little more exact).....theres just too much evidence to point to the fact that the Liberation of Iraq was not just for the citizens living under an oppressive tyrant who used his chem. weapons against them, but also liberating the opportunity for Saddam to use the "Non-Existent WMD's" against us and our allies....this war is a war on Terror...and thats exactly what Afghan. and Iraq posed the threat of

AND ON A FINAL NOTE---------The WMDs have been found a long time ago, but the Demons and the DSM just keep moving goalposts further and further. Next thing you know, it won't be a WMD stockpile unless it has all 3 types of WMD (chem,bio,nuke) and be located in a storage and production complex the size of Baghdad.

AND ON A FINAL FINAL NOTE:

Concerning the whole English speaking thing.....i honestly find it scary that one can take a citizenship test in their native language ,my mom and I who were both born in Germany (me on a US airbase=free ride into citizenship) my mom researched and found that if she wanted to she could take the test in German, which tends not to matter now because she speaks flawless English...but the point is still there.....Im sick and tired of watching the Liberal run media/news and hearing how we are the bad guys profileing and discriminating against the Hispanics for calling them Illegal "Aliens" and wanting to ask for proof of citizenship at the voting polls......WHAT DONT YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT THE WORD "ILLEGAL!!!!????"....kemon people this is getting sad......my solution= BERLIN WALL v. 2.0 all along the mexico/US border with selective gateways along it....easier to control...safer...........but wait nope nevermind, that would be discriminatory

AND NOW IM DONE:icon_biggrin:

[MidnightRider]

Well said, and good post

[Dascoo]

WTF they didn't find any WMD's.....wow great job where the hell are you getting your information from? Please so show us, because of right now to my current knowledge there were no WMD's found, just some documents that make no sense. And even if they did, WHAT THE *copulaste* WOULD THEY DO WITH IT, ONE SHOT, AND THEY WOULD BE VAPOURIZED.

Plus, afghanistan is the only country i agree that needed those terrorists kicked out....o wait bush waited months for most of the leaders to get out.....great job bush.

Also no comment on bush saying the atheists aren't citizens?

[Alpha_Pasta]

You argued for a pull out in Iraq in an earlier post Dascoo?

Whatever the views on the ethics on the war of 2003 there - surely we can agree that a pull out now would be wrong? We would leave a country to completely desintegrate, perhaps being responsible for 10s of thousands of deaths...maybe evern hundreds.

[Master_of_Puppets]

they found 500 chemical weapons....musterd gas, and nerve agents (VX), those of which Saddam said he disposed of, he lied, we went in and found em....they were old but still harmful, and yes those are WMD's, and now you will tell me that we gave them to Saddam during the Iran/Iraq conflict....we gave both sides weapons....did the same in WW1+2 for the Brits and the Germans...i dont care who is president, War is a big buisness that makes money.... but yes,we found WMD's they did exisist and i tell you the rest are in the Bekka Valley in Syria moved by the Russians

[PZIV]

they found 500 chemical weapons....musterd gas, and nerve agents (VX), those of which Saddam said he disposed of, he lied, we went in and found em....they were old but still harmful, and yes those are WMD's, and now you will tell me that we gave them to Saddam during the Iran/Iraq conflict....we gave both sides weapons....did the same in WW1+2 for the Brits and the Germans...i dont care who is president, War is a big buisness that makes money.... but yes,we found WMD's they did exisist and i tell you the rest are in the Bekka Valley in Syria moved by the Russians

I understand what you're saying, but the US never gave the Germans weapons. German U-boats were instructed to sink US vessels. ALL of them...

[Dascoo]

By WMD I thought you meant something of the sorts as nuclear weapons, but yeah i know about the chemical weapons....anyways, it doesn't count as mass destruction to me. It just poison's people, and kills them, not destroy everything within a 10 km radius and make everything surrounding that radioactive for thousands of years.

You argued for a pull out in Iraq in an earlier post Dascoo?


Obviously

[Master_of_Puppets]

Ok, US did not sell whole weapons to the Germans during WW2 as they did during the first one, but they did sell the materials for making weapons of war to the Germans and Japos....US did make some dirty money, but like i said, war is big buisness (and no NOT OIL) as some of you mis-informed ignoramuses still to this day believe thats what Iraq is about

[Master_of_Puppets]

PS: Dascoo

W.M.D. n : a weapon that kills or injures civilian as well as military personnel (nuclear and chemical and biological weapons)

Any modern dictionary will tell you the same thing


Oh and by the way....Totenkopf...i believe i played with you several times on Austin Servers COD---small world

[Dascoo]

I Know the definition, but I'm just saying if it doesn't do huge damage, just poison's things, and doesn't do massive damage to the enviroment, then it doesn't count to me!

[the_morning_of]

the term weapons of mass destruction has been put upon the minds of people around the world following recent horriffic events , such as what happened in japan using Sarin nerve agent,and for sadam using chemical weapons in iraq. most people belive NBC weapons (nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons) as a collective for chemical weapons, this may not be correct a warhead would indeed cause mass destruction, but some apllications of chemical weapons may be on a very small scope (say one person) all wmd's may not cause huge devestation a better way of describing these weapons would be to say tht they are weapons tht kill people in a more horrific way than say guns ,or just destroying buldings they create panic . so at the end of the day all these weapons are used as badly as the dicator wishes them to be so weather they found wmd or not saddam was a horriffic dicator end of.

edit; removed the black colour as it made it difficult to read - BB1

[BritishBulldog1]

Well, I would disagree with Dascoo. Anything that has the ability to destroy huge numbers of human life with a single application should be considered a WMD as well as anything that can destroy large numbers of buildings.

BB1

[Dascoo]

Pfffft people.....I could kill many people with an ak 47, so why isn't it considered a weapon of mass destruction since it's the most used gun in the world.

[PZIV]

PS: Dascoo

W.M.D. n : a weapon that kills or injures civilian as well as military personnel (nuclear and chemical and biological weapons)

Any modern dictionary will tell you the same thing


Oh and by the way....Totenkopf...i believe i played with you several times on Austin Servers COD---small world

Hmm...It might have been me, what was your name?

[BritishBulldog1]

Pfffft people.....I could kill many people with an ak 47, so why isn't it considered a weapon of mass destruction since it's the most used gun in the world.

But you could only kill one person at a time, rather than hundreds or thousands with a single application/shot.

Is it really that difficult to understand the concept?

BB1

[Dascoo]

No, I understand it. I just didn't think of just the death of people mass destruction.

[Col.Darby]

Such name calling. First off smart guys, the Senator I was refering to was John McCain, NOT John Kerry. Find the words John Kerry anywhere in my post, I dare you. And to the point of being a "limp wristed liberal", I have never cast a vote for a Democratic Nominee in a Preidential election, I'm an Independent.
And to the Gentleman who compared Bush to F.D.R and Lincoln, that may be the greatest misjustice either of those two men have ever recieved. They held the Nation together in WW2 and brought the Nation back together after the Civil War. Bush has divided the Nation at every chance given him. Now resume the petty mud slinging at me since" I'm not with you, that makes me against you. " Isn't that was Bush Says?

[MidnightRider]

Such name calling. First off smart guys, the Senator I was refering to was John McCain, NOT John Kerry. Find the words John Kerry anywhere in my post, I dare you. And to the point of being a "limp wristed liberal", I have never cast a vote for a Democratic Nominee in a Preidential election, I'm an Independent.
And to the Gentleman who compared Bush to F.D.R and Lincoln, that may be the greatest misjustice either of those two men have ever recieved. They held the Nation together in WW2 and brought the Nation back together after the Civil War. Bush has divided the Nation at every chance given him. Now resume the petty mud slinging at me since" I'm not with you, that makes me against you. " Isn't that was Bush Says?
Forgive the misunderstanding regarding Kerry. Honest mistake.

I find something intregeing about this statement here ...

And to the point of being a "limp wristed liberal", I have never cast a vote for a Democratic Nominee in a Preidential election, I'm an Independent.

You saying you have never voted for a democrat and calling yourself an independent dont make sence. Im my mind an independent will vote for who they think is best, regardless of poltical party. independents think outside the box of im a democrat or im a republican. So by your very words you have contridcted yourself by saing you have never voted for a democrat.

I didnt see any mud slinging at you, i only saw ppl debateing against your thoughts and opinions. Is that not what you are doing too?

[Master_of_Puppets]

well first off.....you must be a liberal because dont read things throughly. I wasnt COMPAIRING Bush to Lincoln/FDR, they were merely being used as an example of presidents with no prior military history because in your previous post to the one in question, you spent the first half talking about "who never fought" and school grades. And if your going to throw the mistaken Kerry/McCain thing in my direction, It wasnt a mistake, i knew it was McCain who got captured and tortured. I was simply saying your hero Kerry because your post pointed me to believe you were a liberal....short phrases such as "Bush is tupid!" then going on to explain his grades to support such an underminded statement such as that?, you bash a war that you probably think is about oil and revenge for a failed assasination plot, you insult Americans for acting like we all turn a blind eye to our troops and war, claiming that all we do is buy bumper stickers. Now i take it that you are Santa Clause, sending your precious care packages to Iraq every chance you get? and yes i recycle....i pay to do so mind you....and you say that he divided the nation?....yeah, because of people like you,and the liberals (who are a minority in a nation who can be brainwashed and won over with the media: resulting in a minority with the loudest voice) who refuse to understand why things are done for the right reasons-----no petty mud slinging just a debate

-There is no neutrality in the war on terrorism....how hard is that to understand
If you are a country NOT AGAINST TERRORISM, then you must be one that SUPPORTS IT

[Oshiri]

this is why democracy doesnt really work all too well at actually getting things done.. all (bad) argument :P anyways.. just an observation.

[Flarius]

Bush=====BAD, HE SUCKS, i don't even need to live in america to know that!

[BritishBulldog1]

Bad argument flarious, I don't live in America and totally disagree with you. You will note however, that this is a debate and to partake in a debate, you must provide your reasoning. I have already made a number of points in favour of Bush. Would you care to illucidate as to why you think he is so bad?

BB1

[Dascoo]

Because of his existence as being president of the most powerful country in the world, and him having an IQ under 130, don't you think that's a little dangerous? Plus he's an ultra born again christian.......yes that is a bad thing in my opinion.

[Oshiri]

and his oil greed.

[BritishBulldog1]

Sorry Dascoo, that is totally irrational thinking and Oshiri also has it wrong. This has nothing to do with Oil. There are enough friendly places with oil, it's not all in Iraq.

Come on guys, lets have some solid political and economic reasons why he is no good for the country, not personal viewpoints on his character.

BB1

[Dascoo]

Ahem....I don't think you get the point. Iraq was doing bad things already. So instead of saying "WER ATTAKING IRACISTAN BECUS OF OIL" he says he wants to overthrow that evil son of a bitch.

It's not irrational, it makes sense. If he really wanted to do "war on terrorism" attack Pakistan and Saudi Arabia also.

[BritishBulldog1]

Ahem....I don't think you get the point. Iraq was doing bad things already. So instead of saying "WER ATTAKING IRACISTAN BECUS OF OIL" he says he wants to overthrow that evil son of a bitch.

It's not irrational, it makes sense. If he really wanted to do "war on terrorism" attack Pakistan and Saudi Arabia also.

You are assuming that it's because of oil, but it would have been cheaper to bribe Saddam then go to war. Your logic is flawed imho. As for Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, those goverments are trying to help so why would he/we attack them? Now, if you said Iran, I could understand the comment, but not to governments thats are (on the face of it) "friendly."

BB1

[Master_of_Puppets]

I know, for anti-war/Bush protestors, it's all about the oil. Because there can't possibly be any other reason that would drive a nation to war such as bringing down a dictator who was hiding WMD's, and was a major threat to us and our allies, right? Because EVERYONE in the government is totally corrupt, because that's the only way a war simply over oil could ever occur....i mean listen to yourselves, to think that its all about oil and that Bush is some evil Oil monster who wants to get his hands on a country that at its peak of production produced only about 2.5 million barrels of oil a day, or less than 3 percent of the world's supply. Oil goes on the free market and is bid upon by any nation that wants to buy it at that price. The easiest way for the United States to get Iraqi oil would be to write a contract for it, not go to war with them. If we wanted oil, war would be the last thing we would want to do.

-jesus people, ok, sure Bush's family grew up in the oil buisness but to say that he is so hell bent on getting more of it that he would invade a "sovereign nation"(as the anties love to call it) and put the lives of thousands upon thousands of Americans at risk to do so, would be like saying a president who's family grew up and became wealthy in the Diamond buisness would want to invade South Africa because of their vast Diamond mines

-Youpeople need to come up with better arguments about not likeing Bush other than "He's stupid....just because"----"He loves oil thats the only reason he invaded Iraq"

[Dascoo]

Holy crap there not a major threat, DON'T YOU GET THAT! What country now would launch a nuclear attack on another country? So really, there's no threat.

Puppet's, Iraq is first.

[BritishBulldog1]

Dascoo, Iraq wasn't invaded for any specific threat. What is it you don't understand? After ten years of evading the UN weapons inspectors and foiling every move they made, they were making the UN look stupid and toothless. Bush (and I guess Blair) had the courage to say enough is enough. A UN resolution was made that told Iraq that there WOULD be serious consequences if they didn't co-operate. THAT is the reason why this all took place. Blame Saddam, not the Allies and in particular NOT Bush.

BB1

[Dascoo]

Well then you just proved that it is pointless. So basically, they attacked Iraq because they made them look stupid and killed there pride?
Ooooo i love the word pride.

[Master_of_Puppets]

so you proved that you dont know what to think anymore drascoo....youve just abandond you whole oil theory just to agree to an idea that it was a pointless war (when it wasnt)

[Dascoo]

No, I still haven't given up on my opinion on that subject, but what BB1 said, is that it's pointless, so in his case, it is pointless from what he said.

So basically you two are in support of a pointless war, where men died pointlessly. But your actually right. I started thinking about it. The united states has been spending billions of dollars on there military, with no country to fight for such a long time....damn I can't imagine how bad those M1 Abrams felt. So actually men died because the united states army was bored......plus it puts the population of those human's down just little. At least there doing there part I guess :icon_wink:

[Master_of_Puppets]

Thats really sad you know, after all the facts that we have given, you still purely believe that you are right in the idea that it is a pointless war....when all the evidence to back up your theory is that Bush is stupid because of some of his grades, and that his family came up in the oil industry.....face it Drascoo you dont have the evidence to back up your claims, you cant say that it was a pointless war and i find it pretty sad that you are trying so hard to proove that those brave folks who died, did so for no reason whatsoever.....thats just about the same as saying that you dont support them....lets just face it that you are wrong in this one

[Dascoo]

WHY THE HELL DO PEOPLE KEEP ON SPELLING MY NAME DRASCOO!

So anyways, I've seen my share of movies, and videos. I've seen loose change (which is retarded imo), but farhenhite 911 doesn't doubt me.

Okay Mask of puppet's, now your being hypocritical. Your ignoring the fact that I said even if a country had WMD's they wouldn't do anything with them, and you should know why. Plus, I'm not ignoring his facts. I stated my reasons why I think it's a pointless war.

1. They didn't find any WMD's in Iraq. They had them BEFORE, but now there gone. But bush says "LAWL we know you haev tem" and launches an assault on Iraq. Still no WMD stockpiles found. If you actually have evidence to support that during the invasion of Iraq that there were WMD's in Iraq, then more power to yah.
2. Yes, it's hard to believe, but those men and women died pointlessly. I think it's sad, and bush should get punished for that. Instead of making Iraq all happy, it's gonna have a civil war soon YAY!!@1
3. Iraq has oil. I'm not stating that the united states army is there just because of oil, I'm just saying it may be one of the reasons.

BB1, you know Saudi's are actually funding the terrorists? Seems like the Saudi Arabian government is doing a great job.

Also, your lucky I'm not a nut whose going "THE REAL REASON WHY ALL THIS IS HAPPENING IS BECAUSE IT'S THE APOCALYSPE AND THIS IS A WAR ON CHRISTIANITY AND WE SHOULD KILL ALL THOSE MUSLIMS"

[BritishBulldog1]

I don't doubt that there are Saudi's funding the terrorists, but I very much doubt that it's the government of Saudi Arabia. As for your, "they wouldn't use them," theory. Saddam used them on Iran, the Kurds and Israel. Your argument just does not hold water. Plus, I never stated it was a pointless war, that is your interpretation of what I said, but it certainly is not what I meant.

There is no question that Saddam was pursuing WMD, even the Russians believed he had them. If Saddam had not persistantly defied the UN, he would still be in power and I never said he made the USA look stupid.

At the time the decision was made to attack Iraq, it was the right decision. Would they do it again knowing what they now know, probably not, but now we are there, we cannot simply walk away and leave them to it. That would also be very wrong and an abdication of our responsibilities.

BB1

[Master_of_Puppets]

first off- nice way to butcher my name....i really dont take offence to it because ITS A BLOGGING WEBSITE....jesus get over it, it was a mistake in mis-spelling your name

2. THEY DID FIND WMD's it was covered on the news but not as much as it should have been....the democrat/liberals are all saying that "those wernt' the ones we were looking for" i dont give a rat's ass if it wasnt, the fact of the matter is that Saddam lied about having them, then he lied about destroying them. He was a threat. And yes if a radical idiot had the wmd's he WOULD use them....just so happens that Saddam was just smart enough to hold off with them and he just used em on his own people and towns. But Amedinejad (*spelling*) is one who wouldnt hesitate to use a nuke if he had one (thus the whole UN talks and threats to use sanctions) the guy even said that Israel should be wiped off the map.

The whole point of the war was: First, Iraq had developed WMD's ,had a history of aggression against its neighbors, and has sponsored international terrorism.
Iraq did use poison gas against Iran and its own citizens, had nuclear and biological weapons programs, and aggressed against Iran and Kuwait...The fact is that Iraq HAD the WMD's, proabably STILL HAD THEM when we had the wep. inspectors come in, and moved them to Syria imediately prior to the invasion with the help of Russian forces.....

--seriously you are making saddam sound like the good guy here

[Dascoo]

Holy crap, i just googled a bunch of stuff. I had 2 republican sites telling me they did, and 1 republican site saying they didn't. Then all the librael sites saying they didn't. So anywho, I didn't say the saudi government was funding them, but some people in saudi arabia are. Links plzkthxbai to news on WMD's found.

Iraq wasn't really a threat to other countries, just to the people in Iraq. Was it really worth the lives and money? I don't really think so. As far as I know, there was not a huge amount of seperatists in Iraq. Maybe some wanted saddam dead, but I think most just didn't care. Why? Because there used to the way they live. If they wanted freedom, you fight for freedom. I know I've said this alot of times.

And those WMD's that he had.....there not really WMD's....it's some old crappy gas that could kill a few people, you're making it sound like it could take out an entire city. He didn't have any super mass destructive biological weapon. He had gas that any country could make.

BB1 I know you didn't state it was a pointless, the way you said made it sound like you did. Master, I wasn't butchering your name, I made a mistake. Sorry for the misunderstanding.....you know I was just thinking, chaos would be all like OMFG YOU SUCK GO KILL YOURSELF if you dissagreed with him.

[Master_of_Puppets]

well hey, agree to disagree

-i for one think that you are wrong and that your lack of information and the facts behind the whole thing make it almost impossible to think that the war was a wrong choice...but then again you probably think i as well as Bulldog, a majority of the armed forces, as well as the level-headed thinking americans who dont buy into the whole oil conspiracy are wrong as well

-just one last thing----the Iraqis are selling oil in euros, not dollars.....we are not stealing the oil because its going on the free market, i think if we were the evil do'ers....stealing it would mean outrageously low gas prices because we would be shipping it in as fast as the tankers could go....the WMD's will/willnot be found in the Beckka valley depending on whether or not we go into Syria (unfortunately it wont happen)----but believe me, they are there, moved by the russians

-but as i will say again-----agree to disagree----i think you are wrong, you think i am wrong....but i just have to say look at all information, that is so credible that the liberal news does not want to show it, for fear that others would change their views----compared to your views and people like you who can only provide theorys that are not credible and rely on the idea that Bush is an evil man who bought an election just for personal gain of a country's oil supply that produces less than 3% of the world's oil----if the man wanted oil, why not go after Saudi. "I'm sure he could of fabricated WMD's there as well"

---once more...agree to disagree

[Dascoo]

Your saying exactly what I'm thinking except opposite. You haven't shown enough information to me either. Your just saying these things, not giving links, pictures, or videos. Maybe we'll have a serious....argument later.

We're all evil do'ers anyways. We're using oil.

[MidnightRider]

What was the question again?

[BritishBulldog1]

Dascoo, you triviatise the use of Gas and the WMD found. Ask Iran and the Kurds if these WMD's only harmed one or two people - it was thousands!

By the way, the WMD found as I recall, were aging war heads. The fact is they were found, they existed, they were capable of delivering noxious substances. No, I don't have a link, I'm going by memory of the news reports at the time.

So many people pilliarise Bush, but conveniently forget that he had to get the backing of the whole Government. It was NOT his decision alone. Are you saying that your whole goverment is full of stupid people? Just remember, it takes a reasonable degree of intelligence to get to the postion that these people have attained. Why do so many people complain, but aren't clever enough to make the grade themselves?

BB1

[Master_of_Puppets]

Drascoo.....the info ive submitted can be found on the internet....all you have to do is search--its easy enough....as for your info, the only factual information found is Bush's grades (however stupid that argument may be)---as for the rest of your argument; sure it can be found but only in a bias format...its not factual and is only based on theoretical rhetoric from the left sided media and press


if i search for "Iraq war about oil" or something to that effect all i will find is liberal websites who quote major anti-bush people---and unfactual info---just personal ideas and beliefs

---but once again agree to disagree

[Dascoo]

^Ditto.




Dascoo, you triviatise the use of Gas and the WMD found. Ask Iran and the Kurds if these WMD's only harmed one or two people - it was thousands!

By the way, the WMD found as I recall, were aging war heads. The fact is they were found, they existed, they were capable of delivering noxious substances. No, I don't have a link, I'm going by memory of the news reports at the time.

So many people pilliarise Bush, but conveniently forget that he had to get the backing of the whole Government. It was NOT his decision alone. Are you saying that your whole goverment is full of stupid people? Just remember, it takes a reasonable degree of intelligence to get to the postion that these people have attained. Why do so many people complain, but aren't clever enough to make the grade themselves?

BB1

Actually instead of intelligence he had a brother. Plus, if he asks stupid on television then he's giving a bad image on the american's, so that's not good either.

Those gases aren't that bad by what I meant. If it was biological, like let's say a jar of it could kill 50 people, then yes that's mass destruction. Those things were killing thousands of people, but how much gas did he use? Alot.

[mafman124]

Well, i'm going to NY in October - maybe I can see for myself what some of America is like. I've heard a lot about gun crime and gang violence.


Well if your against guns its not going to change. Also all you people who comment on the no child left behind no nothing about. Its not my fault that you watch CNN and get brain washed by it. I dont watch the news I read books on both sides of the spectrum and formulate my own opionon. People need to be educated and not go off on emotions which is what this whole thread is. READ A BOOK!

[mafman124]

Does anyone know why Bush is always saying he is fighting "The War on Terror" to protect American Liberties and Freedoms but if you dare use those "Freedoms" by speaking out against him you are a "Nazi" or you Love the Terrorists? Oh by the way, it's the same speech he's been saying for five years now. Did you all know that Halliburton,(Dick Cheney's Cash Cow) sold Nuculear technology to Iran to enrich uranium?


How the HELL is this true when America is based soley upon freedom of speech and media. This is one of the most brainless posts I have ever read. I double posted because this deserves a whole nother comment.

[Master_of_Puppets]

Dascoo

- Over the span of two days in March (88'), the ethnic Kurd city of Halabja in northern Iraq (population 70,000) was bombarded with twenty chemical and cluster bombs, which included sarin. An estimated 5,000 people died.

-so dont say that the **** that Saddam had and lied about destroying was only harmful in outrageous amounts----"Those things were killing thousands of people, but how much gas did he use? Alot."....(it only 20 small muintions).....after the enitial 5,000 deaths the rest of the town suffered for years after with really bad after effects....the damn chemicals can still be found in the water and food supplies of that town 18 years after.

[Dascoo]

20 and only 5,000? One 20 kiloton nuke could kill 1 million people easily. And atleast the land could still be populated.

20 is alot.....if you said 5 or maybe 6 then yes, fine, he had weapons of mass destruction, but that's nothing (compared to a normal nuclear weapon, or a biological weapon which would spread and kill not just 5,000 people, but millions, possibly even more then a nuclear weapon). Now by nothing, I don't mean those people were nothing.....don't take that the wrong way.

That's destruction, but it isn't mass destruction.....hey maybe if he had a nuke, then maybe it was worth it.......maybe

[mafman124]

I enjoy hearing arguments from both sides of the political spectrum, but when people base their opionons soley on the emotions they feel and not about fact is what make politically educated people mad.

[Master_of_Puppets]

what is your opinion about the particular topic at hand mafman, and could you elaborate on the emotions because right now my arguments are based soley on factual information

[Dascoo]

He's arguing on something else isn't he? We're having a discussion on pointless war and guns?

[mafman124]

He's arguing on something else isn't he? We're having a discussion on pointless war and guns?

Considering that there were more than 6 posts dedicated to the no child left behind act I consider it on topic. Also the emotions I am talking about are the liberals who base their opionons on feelings and not fact. READ A BOOK! Have an arguement not just what you think. Bush is a good leader, our country could of layed down and took it up the rear after 9/11 but we didnt. Through Bush's leadership we bounced back and unified as a stronger America. Now we are being divided again.

[Master_of_Puppets]

Dascoo-

i honestly think HE could have answered that one himself and without the whole little quip of "pointless war and guns"

---but while im here let me ask you a few questions...and please answer them directly and not go off into a tangent and forget the question in the first place (hence: Hillary Clinton)

It doesnt matter what YOUR OPINION is of a WMD, the dictionary and UN have already decided that weapons Saddam used on that town in Kurdistan in 88' WAS CHEMICAL WEAPONRY and that IS considered A WMD along with bio and nukes....so we knew that he had them and the whole debate was if he STILL had them or indeed destroyed them we and the UN told him to.....so my questions to you is this

Q:Saddam knew that if he didnt destroy he WMD's that military intervention would take place: So why would Saddam not have properly documented the destruction of these weapons so that there would be undeniable proof that he no longer possessed these, which would have saved his own skin?

Q: Why do YOU think the Iraqis bugged the hotel rooms, cars, offices, resturants, etc.. the weapons inspectors were using back in 98' and in now 02'?? could it possibly have been so that they had 24 hours notification of which sites UNSCOM was going to next, so they could "prepare" these sites and move what they didnt want being seen by UNSCOM?

Q: Why were the weapons inspectors DENIED access to 8 of Saddam's presidential palaces? when they were told that there would be complete cooperation and mind you these palaces are not some pretty mansion with a swimming pool but actually huge compounds that cover up to 10 square miles and contain up to 700 buildings above and below the surface of the land

Q: Why do you think the Iraqis used false documentation, and misrepresentation of the roles of government personnel and the purpose of facilities that we very well knew were weapons factories?....i mean kemon they even said that some of their weapons labs were "BABY MILK FACTORIES" which magically sprouted security fences and camouflage roofing during the gulf war

If Saddam didnt want to be ousted why did he make it so hard to PROOVE that he didnt have these weapons..why all the decieving and running around ....he violated over 13 UN resolutions and instead of sitting with their thumbs up their asses constantly wanting to give Saddam more and more time and another chance to make things right, the US went in a did something about it before Saddam had the chance to go ape**** on the free world

and just once last and final thing.....i provided some things that the Inspectors themselves found that might be interesting...its a little hard to read but it make a point

http://www.heritage.org/Research/MiddleEast/images/77117925.gif

AND

http://www.heritage.org/Research/MiddleEast/images/53597323.gif

[Dascoo]

Well now I agree. Isn't it great when people show evidence?

Now if Iraq did have WMD's, tell me why they would use them on any country, just to be annhilated? If they used it on there people, maybe they'd get even more pissed and have there own civil war, and THEN it would be ok to attack.

Yes, I know those weapons are classified as WMD's. But I just said my opinion.

Q: So why would Saddam not have properly documented the destruction of these weapons
He's got great humor

[mafman124]

Dascoo-

i honestly think HE could have answered that one himself and without the whole little quip of "pointless war and guns"

---but while im here let me ask you a few questions...and please answer them directly and not go off into a tangent and forget the question in the first place (hence: Hillary Clinton)

It doesnt matter what YOUR OPINION is of a WMD, the dictionary and UN have already decided that weapons Saddam used on that town in Kurdistan in 88' WAS CHEMICAL WEAPONRY and that IS considered A WMD along with bio and nukes....so we knew that he had them and the whole debate was if he STILL had them or indeed destroyed them we and the UN told him to.....so my questions to you is this

Q:Saddam knew that if he didnt destroy he WMD's that military intervention would take place: So why would Saddam not have properly documented the destruction of these weapons so that there would be undeniable proof that he no longer possessed these, which would have saved his own skin?

Q: Why do YOU think the Iraqis bugged the hotel rooms, cars, offices, resturants, etc.. the weapons inspectors were using back in 98' and in now 02'?? could it possibly have been so that they had 24 hours notification of which sites UNSCOM was going to next, so they could "prepare" these sites and move what they didnt want being seen by UNSCOM?

Q: Why were the weapons inspectors DENIED access to 8 of Saddam's presidential palaces? when they were told that there would be complete cooperation and mind you these palaces are not some pretty mansion with a swimming pool but actually huge compounds that cover up to 10 square miles and contain up to 700 buildings above and below the surface of the land

Q: Why do you think the Iraqis used false documentation, and misrepresentation of the roles of government personnel and the purpose of facilities that we very well knew were weapons factories?....i mean kemon they even said that some of their weapons labs were "BABY MILK FACTORIES" which magically sprouted security fences and camouflage roofing during the gulf war

If Saddam didnt want to be ousted why did he make it so hard to PROOVE that he didnt have these weapons..why all the decieving and running around ....he violated over 13 UN resolutions and instead of sitting with their thumbs up their asses constantly wanting to give Saddam more and more time and another chance to make things right, the US went in a did something about it before Saddam had the chance to go ape**** on the free world

and just once last and final thing.....i provided some things that the Inspectors themselves found that might be interesting...its a little hard to read but it make a point

http://www.heritage.org/Research/MiddleEast/images/77117925.gif

AND

http://www.heritage.org/Research/MiddleEast/images/53597323.gif




Great post all liberals need to see this!

[Dascoo]

O, I'm not liberal....just in case you don't know...